Mandi Bishop, a.k.a. @MandiBPro, is one of the best-known health IT influencers, but that doesn’t mean that everyone is using best practices when attempting to engage her in influencer marketing campaigns. Learn from the pro as she dishes on tips for approaching influencers. Listen as she shares how empathy and an acknowledgement of budgetary restrictions can help in assisting clinicians who are reluctant to implement connected health platforms; then dive deep to understand the correlation between digital engagement, patient satisfaction scores, and reimbursement rates. Mandi also explains why we didn’t see very many patients at HIMSS this year but why we will see more in 2017.
Air Date: April 20, 2016
Guest: Mandi Bishop, Health Plan Analytics Innovation Practice Lead, Dell
|Introducing Mandi Bishop
|What to do and what not to do in health IT influencer marketing
|Don’t necessarily treat influencers like media
|Ain’t nobody got time for that!
|Why patients weren’t at HIMSS 16 and why they will be at HIMSS 17
|The hardest part about Patients Included isn’t ideas, it’s mobilizing
|How to help clinicians overcome their pain points about empowering patients
|Digital engagement is related to patient satisfaction scores, and therefore, reimbursement rates
|Help clinicians take tiptoe steps
|We fail to consider the pressures that providers face
|Even if you don’t post anything, use social engagement to start listening
|Top tips for health IT marketers
|Do your homework and understand who the influencers are
|Bonus question: If you could join a rock band or music artist for a day, who would it be?
About Mandi Bishop
Mandi Bishop is a data management veteran consultant, blogger, and health IT social media maven who has been working with healthcare organizations for the past decade at all stops along a patient’s continuum of care.
From payers to providers, and clearinghouses in-between, Mandi’s body of work includes managing complex environment integrations, clinical data exchange, and big data analytics initiatives. Here are some highlights:
- Implemented Meaningful Use 2014 Edition CEHRT EMRs (and pointing out those EMRs that should NOT have been certified)
- Implemented HIE and integrated HL7 ADT, ORU, MTM, and CDA data with multiple disparate EMRs
- Implemented EMPI and Provider Hub identity management solutions · Designed clinical, patient, and provider subject areas and source data integration opportunities for next-generation payer data warehouse
- Developed surgical optimization analytics application, supporting data capture framework and underlying data model
- Developed specialized-registry surgical adverse event reporting submission file specifications and analytics for PSO
She can be reached on Twitter at @MandiBPro.
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Jared Johnson: Hello, my friends and welcome to the Health IT Marketer podcast, the podcast that tells the story of innovation in Health IT. I am your host Jared Johnson of Ultera Digital, healthcare influencer and content marketing. This is the first and only podcast dedicated to the health IT marketing community. Welcome aboard.
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On this program our guests share ideas to help you tell the story of innovation in health IT and to build your audience one gig at a time. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again that this is really in my opinion like the Lollapalooza of health IT marketing, or maybe that’s a date of reference. Maybe today it’s more like the Coachella of health IT marketing.
One way or the other, my upcoming guests include more rock stars such as industry veteran John Glaser talking about his new role as VP for Population Health at Cerner. By the way, he and I talked a little about his interest in alternative rock. So you’ll want to stay tuned for that.
We also have upcoming well-known CIO Consultants, David Chow and Sue Schade, as well as Dr. Matt Patterson, the CEO of AirStrip. So keep tuning in each week for more rock stars.
As a reminder, you can find full transcripts of each episode at ulterablog.com. That’s U-L-T-E-R-A blog.com. That was the number one request from you, our listeners, at the end of last year and transcripts really can be useful. You might want to go back and read through some of the comments or find a quote from one of the guests. That will help you socialize their message to your team internally.
So I typically post the transcript about a week after I publish the episode and it’s also included in the description for each episode. You can find the link there. So as always, tweet me and let me know what you think. Let me know if that’s useful for you. You can find me at Jared Piano, that’s J-A-R-E-D P-I-A-N-O, Jared Piano.
All right listeners, we’ve got a treat for you this week. I am here speaking with the one, the only, Mandi Bishop. Mandi, how are you today?
Mandi Bishop: Hey Jared, I’m great thanks. How are you doing?
Jared Johnson: I’m doing fantastic and you said you are hailing today from the great state of Rhode Island?
Mandi Bishop: I am. I’m sitting here in a hotel room looking out at this lovely snow in April here in Providence, Rhode Island, the Ocean State which is now the ice state.
Jared Johnson: In April, man.
Mandi Bishop: In April of all things and being a Florida girl, coming up here and having snow in April is not something I was necessarily prepared to face. But it’s okay. It’s beautiful and it doesn’t happen all that often for me.
Jared Johnson: Well good, yeah because it is a little hard to comprehend for some of us, like you said.
Mandi Bishop: Indeed, I’ve gotten very good at it. It’s not quite as bad as snowpocalypse of 2015, but yeah, having a snowstorm in April is still unusual.
Jared Johnson: Yes, absolutely, absolutely. Well why don’t we give you a second here and why don’t you tell our listeners just a little bit about your background and just where you are, what you’re doing, whatever you want us to know?
Mandi Bishop: Sure. Well for my day job I run Dell’s global healthcare analytics consulting practice. So I have a very long HRE sounding title that I don’t think anybody needs to go into but that is my day job. I’m very excited to have the opportunity to work with the C-Suite executives for both health insurers as well as very large provider organizations all across the country on developing new, innovative healthcare solutions to meet the change and needs of the marketplace.
And then my passion is, as an open data evangelist, and so I’m a steering committee member of Health Datapalooza. I participate on a number of boards. I’m a mentor for a couple of accelerator programs for healthcare startups. I really am just passionate about the opportunities for data and analytics to drive healthcare transformation.
Jared Johnson: Well you’re being modest because there’s a lot more to it. There are a lot of other roles that you play here but I’m glad you focused in on a couple of them here because we could go on and on all day, just about the different roles you played.
Mandi Bishop: Yeah, well and I’m also, and I guess, I mean which we’ll get to talk about, I’m at MandiBPro on Twitter and Instagram and various other social media platforms that I’m experimenting with. So please don’t follow me yet because I have not figured out Snapchat. But I’ve got my 14-year-old trying to teach me how to leverage Snapchat and Vine and Tumblr and all the other platforms that have not yet made it into my repertoire.
But I’m a bit of a social media maven and that is something that has become very near and dear to my heart. It honestly transformed my life and I can’t say enough good things about the role social media should play in healthcare and will begin to play more and more as we continue to move towards a more consumer-driven culture.
Jared Johnson: Well maybe we could do like a millennial focus show and have your 14-year-old on and actually get some insights on Vine and Tumblr and a few of these others because that might be nice for some of our listeners to hear.
Mandi Bishop: She would be awesome and I actually just took a picture of a poem she wrote in 2013 about who she wanted to be when she grows up and she wanted to be a data scientist and she wanted to work in healthcare. And so she is definitely somebody if you ever wanted to do a millennial show, she would love to do it and she likes to talk.
Jared Johnson: Well I was only half joking, so we can coordinate that after the show.
Mandi Bishop: Good deal.
Jared Johnson: Right on. Well let’s latch on to the social media aspect first. Let’s talk about that for a little bit.
Mandi Bishop: Sure.
Jared Johnson: So you’ve had the opportunity to be a HIMSS social media ambassador, including this last year and 2016, and I remember after that some tweets out there just about some of the kind of lamer approaches that you received from vendors as asking, “Hey, since you are an ambassador, can you re-tweet this for me?” and things like that.
Mandi Bishop: Yes.
Jared Johnson: So I’m fascinated by this approach of what different people consider influence marketing and how there are even just different definitions of what that means and can we boil that down to say what are your tips for what to do and what to not do in health IT influencer marketing?
Mandi Bishop: Yeah, sure. Well first, the people who are explicitly telling someone like me to re-tweet and they are giving me very explicit content, and that content is pitch-driven, sales-driven, booth-driven, first the fact that they are sending that to me makes me very aware of they don’t know who I am. They don’t know anything about my style. They don’t know anything about the areas that I care about, nor do they understand that I don’t typically do any type of vendor pitches whatsoever, even though I happen to work for an extraordinarily large vendor.
So yeah, throughout the entire time at HIMSS if I’m not tweeting about coming to the Dell booth, I’m really not going to be re-tweeting any of the information that you explicitly send me telling people to go to your booth. I mean the content wasn’t there and so if you’re going to try to develop an influencer marketer program, you really need to identify first who those influencers are, but then go deeper and understand how those influencers engage and how do they become influencers and in what ways are they influential because there’s a whole lot o . . . there were 20 of us on the social media ambassador program this year and of the 20 of us, we all had very diverse interests.
So I have particular areas of specialization that I hone in on. I’m very, very interested in patient engagement. I’m very, very interested in data and analytics, very interested in population health, social determinants of health. But I’m really not so much interested in the very minute details of policy regulation changes. I’m not very interested in new EHR platform enhancements, like those types of things are not nearly as interesting to me. And so if you’re going to develop an influencer marketing program I think you really need to get to know the influencers. That’s critical.
I also think there are very simple things that each one of the people who approached me could have done very differently, and one of those things is it’s as simple as put an unsubscribe in your email. Give me the option to unsubscribe from ongoing email updates.
I tell you, I’ve been lucky enough to have found, I’ve been a founding member of several social media ambassador programs. HIMSS is one. I founded the AHIP social media ambassador program which is still in its infancy. The health insurance market is a little bit slower to adopt social media. But I was also one of the founding class of TEDMED social media ambassadors.
And so I’m on a number of lists for marketing and PR firms from that work that has happened at these conferences. They add us to their press list. So I think the cumulative effect of being a social media ambassador for all of those organizations over the years led to me being on a very high number of lists and the stuff like not having an unsubscribe link, that’s easy. It’s very easy to make sure that you comply with CAN-SPAM regulations, which are old. But the CAN-SPAM regulations require you to be able to unsubscribe or for someone who receives your emails to be able to unsubscribe.
But it’s also really indicative to me the fact that these people have not done their homework on who is on their list and what those people are about. So it’s very interesting to me and very apparent to me, the PR firms who approach me directly at HIMSS and had something to say, and this has been true over the years, from an influencer perspective, I would much prefer that you have something material for me, that you believe the content is compelling for me.
If you present me with something, if you give me a good story and it’s a story that’s in alignment with the things that you know I care about and you know that I have an opportunity to influence others to engage with, that’s great and I’m much more likely to not just tweet about it but I might write about it. I might do a blab with you. I might do a Google Hangout. There are all kinds of additional opportunities.
But the folks who just kind of throw spaghetti at the wall to see where it sticks and don’t even give me an opportunity to pry that spaghetti off my wall, it just ticks me off.
Jared Johnson: Well, right and one of those things I’ve heard is to not treat influencers like their media because media get paid for a living to do that. They’re paid to cover those things and most of the time influencers who you really want to reach are not getting paid for this. So they’re motivated by either personal passion, like you’ve identified, but also the ability to recognize between that and some kind of reach or expertise that they have that they’re able to make a difference somehow. I mean does that kind of resonate with you?
Mandi Bishop: Yeah, it absolutely does. That does make a really good point. There is a distinction or there may be a distinction. I think some of the people who are social media ambassadors are journalists for living and that is what they do. But there were many of us, I think probably half of us who are not, who do this because we love it and we really are just passionate about the space and we love to engage in the space and the thought leadership and the pieces that we do are not because we’re paid to do them. It’s because it’s just something that we’re really passionate about.
So yeah, understanding that distinction and like you said, not treating us as if we are media outlets, additional media outlets like it almost felt like and it does continue to feel like, because I do still continue to get emails, I’m an alternative to a fax machine. So I think about some of the people in the PR firms who must be faxing out press releases day in, day out, which I can’t imagine the amount of work that goes into that.
But they’re faxing and emailing out press releases all of the time and I feel like a human fax machine. I’m just receiving all of these unsolicited mass quantities of content that may or may not have anything whatsoever to do with an item or that I’m interested.
So my husband got me a really great T-shirt and I love to wear it around the house and it says, “List of things, ain’t nobody got time for, that.” Nobody got time to read 200 emails a day with press releases from various PR firms stating things like . . . nobody’s got time for that. Nobody’s got time for that unless that is your job which is a very different story.
Jared Johnson: Right, it is, isn’t it? It’s a very different job.
Mandi Bishop: It is. It is and I mean I understand like this is an evolving industry and I still think that that’s the challenge, is that social media and influencer marketing, this is a very new field. It is something that a lot of large brands have been doing well for probably a decade. But from a social media standpoint, it’s evolving very, very quickly. The platforms are changing. I joke about my daughter having to teach me these things. But it is evolving faster than the processes that we have in place, the business processes that we have in place to adjust, and so I get it.
So people are just doing what they’ve always done and they’re just sending out the press releases to as wide an area network as they possibly can but that really misses the mark for influencer marketing.
Jared Johnson: Well let’s stick with HIMSS and then talk about actually what’s happening at HIMSS between now and next year. There’s an initiative that you’ve talk about a lot, involving more patients, and I’d love to hear more about the initiative and just why you do feel so passionate about it.
Mandi Bishop: Absolutely. Well it’s funny because I didn’t . . . the first several years that I went to HIMSS I was just so excited to be there and so awed by the size and scope of HIMSS that it did not occur to me that we were all talking about patients and we were all talking about engaging with patients and we were all talking about connecting patients, but I didn’t hear any patients. The closest I came to hearing patients and seeing the patient presence at HIMSS was Regina Holliday who is just a wonderful, amazing patient advocate.
So for anyone who does not know who she is, if you look at #thewalkinggallery and @ReginaHolliday on Twitter. She has become an accidental patient advocate and an open data advocate because of an experience that she had losing her husband. But so anyways, so Regina was there and she was a very vibrant vital presence but I was so stoked to be there and I’m so lost in my own geeky world that I didn’t realize that patients weren’t there, that they weren’t there in mass, that they weren’t a presence that was felt in every booth. That was not a best practice for why that had been implemented.
And then I became close friends with Casey Quinlan who is @Mightycasey and a group of other patient advocates, Jan Oldenburg and Kate Rowe and Carly Medosch and Jess Jacobs. I mean the list goes on. But they started to open my eyes to their lack of a voice or their perception of a lack of a voice, not just at the conference itself but in the planning of the conference and being able to get their talks accepted into the conference.
They’re not just helping plan the events and helping plan for the inclusion of patients but helping plan the educational sessions that the patients were included, and not just included but they were appreciated at the same level as the industry experts. So those folks of the Society for Participatory Medicine, the founding members are Dr. Danny Sands, e-patient Dave deBronkart, so many people over the last year really opened my eyes to the need for a best practice of inclusion at HIMSS, and a gentleman by the name of Lucien Engelen came up with a patients included charter.
So it’s #PatientsIncluded and if you go to patientsincluded.org it talks about five charter clauses for including patients at conferences, things like making sure that there are appropriate ADA facilities for patients, making sure the patient track is included from an educational standpoint. Those kinds of things.
So we talked about how to help HIMSS meet the charter clauses of the Patient Included movement. And then how to go beyond that and how to get the sponsoring organizations, the exhibitors at HIMSS to really buy into the Patients Included concept and to start funding kind of a consortium so that patients can be included at more and more events. Not just included but assisted to get there.
So the hardest part about all of this isn’t the brainstorming. It isn’t coming up with all the ways to make this a win-win proposition. It’s like those are the relatively easy pieces. The hard pieces mobilizing and organizing this massive people who want to be engaged because unfortunately, whether we’re patients or whether we’re just advocating on behalf of this Patient Inclusion program, we’re all volunteers.
So on my spare time I’m trying to find out if there are grant opportunities available to fund a position to help drive this program to actually help make this work and to be able to fund the activities of project managing, where that’s effectively what we’re doing. We’re project managing a patient inclusion effort for HIMSS 2017.
So if any of your listeners out there are aware of a funding action or of a funding opportunity, a grant opportunity, whether it’s through like maybe the national partnership for women and families, Robert Wood Johnson Foundation, Kaiser Family Foundation, if there is an opportunity out there to partner with an organization that may have grant money available for something like this, we would love, love, love to be able to have a patient or a group of patients be granted this.
Have them pull together the grant proposal and then have them be granted that the funding to actually make this happen, I think that would be amazing. So just in case anybody’s got grant money that they would need to find a way to spend.
Jared Johnson: Hopefully that really is the case.
Mandi Bishop: Yeah, because funding is always the problem. We all want to do good but there are finite amounts of time and finite amounts of money.
Jared Johnson: You’re right. You’re so right. Well I’ll tell you what, let’s shift gears a little bit and this maybe opening Pandora’s Box in fact. So from your standpoint, so let’s see how you answer this question. How do you get clinicians to overcome their pain points about empowering patients or about adopting digital health at all? Like how do we help clinicians overcome the things that are keeping them from doing it now?
Mandi Bishop: Well the carrot and stick approach is right and I struggle with this quite a bit. From a carrot perspective I’m always trying to bring it back to the language that is universally understood for corporate America and that’s whether you’re an independent physician practitioner or whether you’re a very large hospital system, your CATs and your HCAT scores talk.
So at the end of the day your reimbursement rate from CMS matters and so having a positive impact on patient experience is something that is actually quantifiable and is now being measured and is continually that the measurements are being refined on continual basis. So there’s physicians and hospital systems have a vested interest in meeting their patients where their patients live and their patients are increasingly living on social media.
I think that the latest research from PEW indicates that more than 40% of all the adult population in the United States, everyone 18 and up, across all income levels, all race and ethnicities, more than 40% of them are on a social media network daily. And I think that the number has reached over 70% of them are accessing all of these networks via their smart phone, their internet-enabled smart phones. So we live in an app-powered society and social engagement is how our members and our patients interact with each other.
And I think about my daughter. I think about her growing up and her friends, millennials don’t talk to each other anymore. They text. And so if you don’t show me something on a screen, it doesn’t exist, and the more that healthcare providers understand how a lack of engagement in a digital context is going to negatively impact their reimbursement rates when it comes to CMS, when it comes to the [inaudible 00:21:55] scores, the more they understand that direct correlation between digital engagement and patient satisfaction, patient experience scores, the better it is that they will, if they have been reluctant, at least they will be willing to try.
And that’s obviously, I hate to have to have that conversation. There are certainly lots of healthcare providers who are excited about the opportunity to go digital. They want omnichannel communications with their patients but there are obviously budgetary constraints that you have to understand and you have to be able to help those providers take tip toeing steps into the digital realm because there are things that are not required. They have to do meaningful use, like if they are part of the CMS program they have to go through meaningful use. Now they’re going to have to comply with MACRA.
If their organization is on the value-based care APAP program, that they’re part of an ACO, so there are all these other mandates that are absolutely required that they have to be able to allocate their time and dollars too before that they’re able to pay attention to digital communication strategies. And I think that that’s a business imperative that a lot of us who are very excited about omnichannel communications miss. We know that it is something that matters. We know that it’s something that can truly transform patient relationships but we fail to consider all of the other pressures that the providers are under and having to meet.
So showing them how to do very low-cost entry point digital communications with their patients is key. So social media is a great one. It’s free. Getting a Facebook account is free. Setting up a Facebook page, it’s free. Setting up Twitter account, it is free. Instagram is free. These are all ways that you can at least begin to engage. You can at least dip your toe in the water and even if you don’t post anything, you can at least start to listen and understand how your patients engage.
And it also develops kind of a more personal one-on-one relationship that so many of us are lacking with our doctors right now and so we talk about customer loyalty and wanting to keep our patient panel. We don’t want to have . . . I think we tell health has like a 35% churn rate. We want to be able to reduce that.
So part of the way to do that is to at least establish a digital presence and start to make that presence known to your patients, even if you have to start dipping your toe in the water with freely available platforms and taking more of a listening approach than a high touch engagement.
Jared Johnson: So if we boil that down, as we start to wrap up here, what would you say are your top tips for health IT marketers?
Mandi Bishop: Oh gosh, okay. So I’m thinking through. For health IT marketers, I think first and foremost, and this is true for anyone and anything. If you go to a job interview you’re going to research the company before you go to the job interview. So when I think about marketers, I think about the amount of research that really should go into a marketing plan. And if you’re going to try to leverage influencer marketing then think about influencers the way you would think about a company that you are researching for a job interview.
You want to at least understand enough to have a 30-second elevator conversation with that person. So whether you have that 30-second elevator conversation via Twitter, whether you have it via email, you want to do your research. Know your stuff. Know who you’re talking to and understand the ways that that person engages or the way that that entity engages. Many of the influencers are obviously brands.
But if you do your homework appropriately around influencer marketing and you develop an understanding of what sphere of influence each brand or person has and what particular topic areas might align to those spheres of influence, then you can look at your content and the content that you have to share from a marketing perspective, and you can being aligning that content to the particular influencers in that space.
So if you don’t do your homework, there’s that whole old adage that if you fail to plan, you plan to fail. If you haven’t done your homework and you don’t understand who the influencers are and for what, you plan to fail. So that’s it. It’s really that. That is at the end of the day, know who they are, know what they care about and then align your content strategy for those influencers to what they care about and you should be golden.
Jared Johnson: That almost fit into 140 characters. I added it up, but that’s pretty close.
Mandi Bishop: That’s right. Yeah, I always try to bring it back to a tweetable moment. Right?
Jared Johnson: Right.
Mandi Bishop: That’s my own little personal content marketing strategy. Boil every meeting down to a tweetable moment.
Jared Johnson: I guess we could make a meme out of it and then that goes, not matter what. It doesn’t matter how many words are on it.
Mandi Bishop: That would be awesome.
Jared Johnson: That’s my work-around lately.
Mandi Bishop: They keep threatening to expand Twitter to 10,000 characters and I pray they don’t. Really, that would be devastating because again, although the list of things ain’t nobody got time for. Ain’t nobody got time to read an entire newsfeed of 10,000 character tweets.
Jared Johnson: Right. I heard and I don’t think it was on April Fools ‘ Day but I had heard that they decided that they won’t go that direction, and I don’t remember where I heard it. So maybe it’s still in rumor phase. But yeah, I would hope, I mean for the love. That’s why we like Twitter. You have to be concise.
Mandi Bishop: Yeah, and I’ll be honest. I use Twitter as a recruiting tool because I find I work best with specific kinds of people and you need to be able to assimilate a lot of information in very little time and to boil it down. Like that is just a core skill that I need on my team and Twitter is a really great way to do that. So I’m finding I use Twitter and tweet chats as a very effective recruiting tool for me, whether it’s like not necessarily actively recruiting people to come and participate but watching people who are participating and things that are already happening and seeing the way that they interact and engage, and being able to understand how effective are they at that type of assimilation of information because that’s crucial for my job.
So yeah, I use tweet chats as one of my barometers for hiring. I know that sounds crazy but it’s true.
Jared Johnson: Great insight and I’m going to keep that in mind now. Just hey people could be thinking this and this, depending on what type of things I post. So I mean very genuinely, that’s a good thing to be aware of when we’re out there.
Mandi Bishop: Yeah.
Jared Johnson: Well awesome. Man, so much packed into a short amount of time here. I want to give us time enough to discuss this very important bonus question which is, if you could join any rock band or music artist for a day, who would that be?
Mandi Bishop: I have lived my entire life wanting to be Mary Chapin Carpenter and so I would absolutely love to spend a day with Mary Chapin Carpenter because I think she is brilliant. She is both a songwriter as well as a musician. She is just brilliant. She is amazing and I happen to resemble her a little bit. So there’s that. So maybe I could be her for a day. Maybe I could be like her stunt double for a day. That would be awesome.
Jared Johnson: There you go. Is she still putting out new stuff?
Mandi Bishop: She is but it’s been a while. Yeah, it’s been a while. From a new artist’s perspective I would have to go with T Swift. I’m a Swifty. I love Taylor Swift. Yeah, yeah, I heart me some Taylor Swift and then Eminem too. I can rap up a storm with Eminem, although people will very much laugh. But yeah, but Mary Chapin Carpenter hasn’t put out anything new in the last five years but she is still awesome.
Jared Johnson: Okay, yeah. That’s still more recently than I realized. So hey, very cool.
Mandi Bishop: Yeah.
Jared Johnson: Well, thanks so much. Thanks for being on the program today. What’s the best way for people to reach you if they have a question? You already mentioned your Twitter handle, want to just mention that one more time?
Mandi Bishop: I absolutely do. Yeah, tweet me, that is the fastest and easiest way to get in touch with me. I am at Mandi, M-A-N-D-I B Pro, P-R-O and be careful to spell the name correctly because my understanding is that there’s an adult film star who has a very similar name. So M-A-N-D-I B P-R-O, not the other one.
Jared Johnson: Glad we spell it out. We take the time to make sure we get the details right on this program. So there we go.
Mandi Bishop: Fantastic.
Jared Johnson: Well I’d love to have you on again some other time in the future. Mandi, thanks for joining us.
Mandi Bishop: Thanks Jared, it was great.
Jared Johnson: Well that wraps up our program this week. What did you think? Let me know what you thought about my interview with Mandi by reaching out on Twitter at Jared Piano, that’s J-A-R-E-D P-I-A-N-O. Also if you enjoyed this episode as much as I know you did, please consider leaving your review on iTunes as well as subscribing on iTunes, on Stitcher Radio or on Podbean.
Ladies and gentlemen remember it’s up to us to tell the story of innovation in health IT and remember to build your audience one gig at a time. Until next time, I’m Jared Johnson and you’ve been listening to the Health IT Marketer Podcast. This program is sponsored by Ultera Digital, healthcare influencer and content marketing. For a full archive, go to HealthITMarketer.com. That’s HealthITMarketer.com and thanks again for joining in. I’ll talk to you again next week.